Friday, February 10, 2012

Is Amway and BWW A Scam?

Very Interesting Testimony:

http://scamadvocates.com/1306-Amway-and-BWW.html

I was at a mall and a couple struck up a conversation about something i was looking to buy at the shop. To be polite i responded and they kept the conversation going and finally they asked my number. I hesitantly gave my number and forgot about the incident. Two weeks later I received a call on a Sunday evening after 7:00 PM from this very same person. After initial chitchat the person mentioned a e-commerce business opportunity which has helped him make money. So we booked a meeting at my home on a Monday evening after work to discuss more on this.

The couple showed up and gave almost no information on the opportunity except for some vague e-commerce concept and invited to an "industry briefing" to be held at a hotel on Wednesday evening at 8:00 PM and I was asked to show up there in business attire.

On Wednesday i went to the hotel where the "industry briefing" was to be held and was forced to sit in the front seat with a paper and pen too to make some notes. The person who spoke was very animated and used some classical phrases undermining how un-fullfilling our jobs were. He showed a business plan and claimed, a person in 3-12 months can start earning 2500+/month and in 3-5 years earn more than 250K per year. At the end he mentioned that they have a product company called 'Amway Global' formerly know as 'Quixtar' and a education system called 'Britt Worldwide" or BWW which work together to make the above claims a reality.
At the end of the seminar i was given a few CD's and a literature material again highlighting what was said in the meeting. Intrigued i asked the person who invited me as to how long he was doing this business and he said that he was doing it for a "couple of years" which i later found out to be 13 years in fact and he was by no means "RICH". He invited me to another meeting on Friday at his place called "PASE - Product and system Education" as a followup. I went to PASE and met a few others who were involved in this business and the meeting had a cult like flavor to it. I did succumb to the pressure to sign up and was asked to sign up then and there.

They asked me to start attending the meetings every week, buy a subscription program for CD's called SOCD which i was told would cost me 7.94$'s per week + taxes making it 8.02$'s, later they also mentioned something called LSO - Leadership Standing Order which would cost me another 8.02$'s per week. I was also asked to sign up for a service called 'CommuniKate' which is a voice messaging servicewhich would cost me 25$'s per month and also asked to open a business website where i could showcase my business based on 3 pre-formated templates which would cost me 15$'s per month.

I confronted as to the validity of all these that i am asked to buy and i was told that all these would make it look like a legitimate business. They also stressed that it is a tax deductible expenses so were all the miles i would drive to these meetings and any contacting meetings i would go to.

I did not know at that time that every Wednesday meeting i would attend would cost me 6$'s per week. I was also asked to buy tickets to "BBS- Business Building Seminar" which would cost me 25$'s per meeting and this is held 4 times a year. Here they introduced something called 'Eagle Program" where every person if he needed to be 'an Eagle' had to buy 300 P.V worth of products from Amway every month else they are 'chicken'. Each P.V was 2.50$'s making it a commitment of 750$'s every month on Products. While doing all these I was yet to see any earnings. They also mentioned about another larger meeting called "conference/ FED/ Leadership" to be held and it would cost me 100$'s. These Large conferences are also held 4 times every year.

To know what happens in the conference you do a bit of search using keywords "Dateline Amway" and look at the video's in the link.

I asked the person who introduced me to this business to provide me with receipts for all the money I had to spend on BWW stuff, like CD's Tickets etc. But i was told that no receipts will be given.

Later I found out that the Big Pins make Tons of money from these tools than Amway itself, and since these were circulated by Hand and money collected through cash and checks without receipt, THIS WAS THE TAX FREE INCOME. REPORTING of this income does not go to IRS, I am sure IRS Does not even know such an income stream exists.

After all weekly meetings, a lots of CD's, compelled to do 300 P.V every month, driving a lot of miles and driving away all my friends and relatives it dawned on me that although Amway Makes good Products and sell them at a Premium and is considered a Legitimate by the Government, its combination with BWW MAKES IT A SCAM.

If you are reading at this account, you are either looking at getting into this business or have a doubt in your mind if your decision was correct to join this business.

If you are OK with all the points i have stated above go ahead and still build the business.

Else Rescue your money, because you will loose a lot of it if you get into this.

221 comments:

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Anonymous said...

Joe must be very successful in life. the time and effort it takes to look up all these things about Amway is amazing. he must give about 500% in his job if he can do this in what i am assuming to be his free time. I am not praising you at all Joe but you are clearly very passionate about this and that is amazing.

Now many people are passionate about Amway and that is also amazing. Even though Joe puts out negative vibes he believes that he is helping people "see the truth" just as people in Amway believe they are helping people.

I say the vibes are negative because they are very confrontational towards people who are happy in the business. Being hostile is counter productive to your efforts. I read the comment above of you asking what does it take to succeed, and i will spill the beans... It takes all the ambition you have to achieve your dream. I sound like a brainwashed goon to you but I have a dream that I want to achieve and this is an alternative solution to achieve my dream, I am working full time to achieve my dream as well. my dream is not to make money, selfish people have that kind of dream, my dream isn't even climbing out of the middle class life I have right now. everything I am typing here falls on bitter ears but my hope is to help someone realize that you have to do your own research and not rely on someone's blog and dont join because your friend invited you to join the business or the person who invited you to a meeting. Don't fall for the bull that people give you, there are honest people in the business trying to make it work, they will tell you it took years to get somewhere, they struggled, gave up, lost hope but they made it work. there are people who are successful outside of the business, who started a company on their own- personally i dont know how to do that as I am still learning to work with money so i know i cant do that yet.

my point is to take the time and decide, maybe you have a great business idea and this isnt exactly what you want to do. but maybe you see the potential in this business and you make it a success. Don't get pressured into deciding and don't underestimate the amount of work that this business takes.

I know that Joe is going to write a bunch questions and comments. but these are just opinions. mine is an opinion and so is Joe's an opinion.

Hilllary Aguada said...

There is this person who sent me a message in LinkedIn and the message goes this way:

"Leslie here, we just connected in LinkedIn a while back. Just looking through your profile, seems pretty impressive. Currently, I'm working together with a few professionals like yourself, on a part time e-commerce distribution business and expanding so we're looking for a few more partners to work with and I feel that you may have the qualities that we're looking for. (Although there'll be no promises). This can be done on top of your full time job. Without disrupting it. Let me know if you're open to income diversification! Regards, Leslie D'Cruz"

I was really skeptical about the message, and just dismissed it as a spam message, but searched the web for "e-commerce" anyway. Because I was really curious as to what this "business opportunity" was.

And so I replied with a polite message telling him thanks for taking the time to look at my profile, and that I would like to know more of this business opportunity he's talking about.

He then sent me another message telling me:

"Yes, today e-commerce is something that is taking over the world. Anyway Hilllary, I'm actually shortlisting and qualifying a few people. Working together with very successful entrepreneurs who are financially independent, and we are offering a personal mentorship programme. Check out the website: Bww.com If what you see appeals to you, we may consider partnering with you Hilllary. Best Regards, Leslie D'Cruz"

And then, that hit me... I had to check the website out. Finally when all I can see in their website was vague descriptions, and testimonials of people who became very "successful", I finally had the hint that something was amiss. I never heard of BWW nor Amway nor IBO. So I had to do some research again.

And finally, I found his blog. Which just confirms that all I there is to it is another scheme or scam.

Anonymous said...

You took the words right out of my mouth. I guess most of them use the exact same tactics on college students. I went through a similar thing, but I'm naturally a skeptic, so I never joined. I only attended a few hotel meetings and PASE meetings. Everyone there seemed brainwashed and totally into the "business". I know a few ppl in BWW and I wish I didn't have to see them lose so much money on it, but they won't listen to me because they seem to really believe in the dreams that were sold to them. It's sad.

Anonymous said...

So, i am reading all this comments since 2014. This woman met me at Walmart. The verbatim speech as mentioned before. Vague information about what the business is. She invited me for the seminar at a hotel , business attire. Sat in the first row. The pitch was presented in such a positive light that you feel you should join as soon as possible. I knew then and there in my gut that its too good to be true. I had my reservations, received a literature packet from them AND YES, I DID GET A CULT VIBE OFF IT. I had talked to my parents prior to that and they said there is no need to get involved in this and that I don't have to do this to earn a little bit extra. I had a GUT FEELING that it is not something for me. So, after this meeting she tells me that she'll come over in 2 days and discuss about when i want to start. I was really reluctant to join in the first place but she just got to me. Next thing I know that I am being pressurized to go to this seminar in Memphis. Like a fool i just gave her my debit card information and paid 130$. I regretted the moment i did that. It was just a gut feeling that it is not something for me so I called that person within an hour of me making the payment and she said that she has already bought the ticket and that she is gonna 'try' to refund me. I mean it has just been an hour. Just cancel the ticket and give me the refund. It is their own corporation, why cannot they do that. Instead, she makes me an offer that she'll just carry forward that fees to my enrollment fees of 190 $
That was the red flag for me and I knew that it is not something i want to get involved in.

So the bottom line is
I dont care if I lose the 130$, I just dont want to get involved in. People will always tell you to take the risk and that opportunities like this will never come again or 10 years down the line you'll regret that you didn't do it. JUST LISTEN TO YOUR GUT FEELING, IF YOU THINK IT IS NOT SOMETHING YOU CARE ABOUT OR ARE REMOTELY INTERESTED IN OR LOOKS JUST EVEN A LITTLE BIT SHADY, JUST DON'T DO IT.

P.S. - I am not questioning their authenticity, it may be a legitimate company, may not be. I did not get a very good vibe so I am not joining this.

Anonymous said...

This is like indirect robbery where people at high place rob people at lower level. Person at lower level has to loose money inorder for person at higher level to gain money. Job should be such that both people get benefitted. Thank you creator of this site/blog. You are saving many lives.

Unknown said...

Anyone can be associated with a business. Doesnt make it legitmate. These amway scams have been around forever. It preys on the weak and brainwashes the masses

KidWhoKnows said...

Anyone can be aasociated with a business. They are not carrying any product from Amyway. Amway been scamming the masses and weak for many years. The weak and $ straped feed this crap until they are dead or broke. They brainwash the masses.

Anonymous said...

Joe

I was an ibo for roughly a year and I really feel the need to share my side of the story as well. It was typical: a recruiter showed me the business opportunity and being the gullible person that I am, I believed much of what they sold. However as the months went by, many additional fees popped up that were not in the business plan. $300 for 100 pv a month plus books, CDs, gas etc. And that was just the beginners level. If you don't cough up cash, you're shunned in your group. What kind of business exists where you're encouraged to lose upwards of $300 a month and expect nothing in return? They withhold information and tell half-truths to mislead people. If I had known this I would have scrammed on the spot. I had given so much time and effort for it to go nowhere.

Looking back, there were already warning signs in the first few months. But I guess I was indoctrinated in their beliefs to leave just then. "Don't ask for advice from outside", "Everyone not in amway is a loser or broke", "We are your friends and we want you to be successful". Some relatives were in amway in the past and discouraged me. Of course, I didn't take their advise at the time. One prospect was formerly in another MLM and explain the flaws of these businesses. That conversation was very eye opening and I couldn't say anything in return. Needless to say, I felt my heart die a little that day. But I still stuck with amway.

Another thing is that they do have very charismatic people. The way these people carry themselves just makes you want to believe in what they say. You need to have the mental strength to see through all their lies. Their suits and "business environment" is just to make it seem like a plausible business. Overpriced products, incompetent uplines, deliberate misinformation, unnecessary tools that feed money into pockets of higher ranks in amway: this is what the business is really about. Your amway friends? They don't give a shit about you. Diamond lifestyle? Rented mansions and cars from people with middle level income who had to recruit everyday and fly everywhere to preach lies.

Soon, this business became... unsustainable for me

This probably won't convince some who are already in the business. But tragically, as said by Joe Cool, self-realization needs to take place and only then can you snap out of this fake dream. It happened to me. The few weeks that followed after I left, I was extremely bitter and depressed and constantly questioned my value as a human being. I looked for those "internet advice" the amway people scorned for solace and chanced upon this blog. And they more I read, the more it seemed similar to my situation. As i read on, it became clear I am the I'm not the one in the wrong, it's the ones who make a living off of lying and selling false hope to people who are wrong.

They claim they're digging for some treasure deep in the ground, but they're actually digging their graves and dragging other people with them. If only I was sensible enough to quit earlier. But I should still consider myself fortunate as I managed to crawl out of a shallow grave. Hard work pays off in the long run. That much is true. But hard work in amway? You are paying your "employer"/upline to work your ass off for them.

In the end, it’s the amway ibos that are worse off than the ”outside people” and the fact that they don’t know this or choose not to believe it, is sad even for me.

There, I've had my say.

Joe Cool, you truly are a blessing.
Thanks for your blog.

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Bharath K Bavikati said...

Please ready my blog spot about How Amway Business model is totally wrong in my opinion?

http://amwayftc.blogspot.com/2017/02/how-amway-business-model-is-totally.html

Anonymous said...

One day, I was at a post office. One guy looked at me and smiled ( I am also a guy). I also smiled. He said, "hello" and asked about myself. We talked for a while. Then I found out that he was also from the same country where I am coming from and studied also at the same University where I did my studies in back home. He asked my phone number. I gave it without any hesitation. On the same day, he messaged me to meet in a coffee shop. I also didn't have any friends. So, I thought this is a good opportunity to become friends.I went to meet him in a coffee shop. He bought a coffee for me and said he can claim this coffee bill under his business name. I asked about his business. He just said, he develop a part time business to make some extra money. Also said, he has a mentor, working for a big software company. He talked about the importance of having an own business rather than working for a company. He also mentioned, he can join me also in his business, but he didn't say anything in detail. He took me email id as well. On the same day night, he sent some Robert kiyasaki's youtube links to watch. Few days later, he asked what did you understand. I said, Going to school, getting good grades, finding a good and secure job, buying a house and diversify our investments are industrial age thinking. Then he asked me to buy and read, business for 21st century. I forgot to buy. He called many times and forced me to buy. I thought, he is a very caring fried. I ordered on the same day in amazon. Got the book in few days. I started to read. That was my first book, finished reading fully. My friend (he also calls me all the time, my friend) messaged me, did you finished reading book? I said, Yes. He checked my understandings about this book. He introduced his mentor also. Both of them asked me to go for a meeting on Tuesday night 8PM. I went there. Many students also came for the first time to attend this meeting. They showed the plan. All came is a suit and tie. Everybody talked nicely. Meeting finished around 10PM. One guy offered me a car ride to my home also. He said me to call my friend on the same day night. I reached home around 10:30PM. He called many times in the night. Finally, I answered around 12AM. He talked more than an hour about the business. He booked an appointment on the following day to join the business. I didn't call, but he called me and asked me to join the business. I also believed, because he always call me "my friend". He always advised me "we all came to this country to become rich". Finally I registered the business by paying $215 when he was on the phone line. Then on the second day he called and asked me to go for PASE meeting which is on Fridays. I went there. They charged $4 per person. Then he keep asking me to go every Tuesdays for open meeting and Fridays for PASE meeting. Both costs $8 per week. In addition, he asked to attend phone meetings as well. Then, he invited me to come for a business conference in USA. I went there also. After that, he asked me to buy products to get 150PV. TO get 150PV, we need to spent at least $600. Products are very very expensive.I don't want to spent $600 to buy stuffs which I don't even need. I could buy the same stuffs less than $200 in wallmart or in other places. But this friend guy, keep calling me to buy. I didn't answer. He got angry and started to argue. You are now a business owner. You should buy from your store. He said some examples, Bill Gates uses Microsoft, not Apple like that. Now I blocked this guy's tel. no. in my phone. Wasted some money and time. Not any more... Anyway, learnt some lesson too.

Anonymous said...

I had same situation, a guy met in store and started talking to me, asked for my number, and called me on weekend and asked me to join meeting for some kind of business opportunity, last Wednesday i have attained the meeting, it was Amway, as people described, i got seat in first row, after meeting i got three CD's. listening those people in meeting and CD's, i got confuse what to do?, and i did google, i found this blog. Now i'm 100% sure.....I'm not going for this monkey business.....

20 year old with a BMW M3 said...


I started in the BWW / AMWAY program about 4 months ago, a client of mine called me and asked if I was intrested I said sure. Now I pull in about $5,000 extra a month and its only growing note that $5,000 extra a month is side money for me, I am a sales rep for BMW. I honestly thought at the start of this it was a scam but I went along with it and now Every day I go to leave my house In my new BMW M3 I'm glad I just went along with it.shoot me a Email if you are the least bit interested buettner199ty@gmail.com and for those of you who don't believe me go check out my Instagram page @buett__

20 year old with a BMW M3 said...


I started in the BWW / AMWAY program about 4 months ago, a client of mine called me and asked if I was intrested I said sure. Now I pull in about $5,000 extra a month and its only growing note that $5,000 extra a month is side money for me, I am a sales rep for BMW. I honestly thought at the start of this it was a scam but I went along with it and now Every day I go to leave my house In my new BMW M3 I'm glad I just went along with it.shoot me a Email if you are the least bit interested buettner199ty@gmail.com and for those of you who don't believe me go check out my Instagram page @buett__

Robin Singh said...

@Joecool: Thank you very much for the page.

There are lots of people here screaming that Amway and BWW is the best way to make money.

I request everyone who wants to invest time/money in Amway to do a quick study before doing so. This is the biggest scam in the world

I lost at least 5 lack Rupees, being part of Amway. Every time i suffer a loss, i kept thinking about the magical world, that i will get eventually. Now i started focusing on my primary job and slowly able to achieve some stability

--RS

Anonymous said...

Amway is a great company there is no denying it. However it is the systems that you have to be careful about. I was a Platinum in the Bww System where they preached about all these cardinals rules about Money, Integrity, Respecting women etc .. Well My upline who was a x helicopter pilot decided to make advances on a girl in another group who was 30 years younger than him . He forced himself on her. When my friend crossline brought this to our upline Diamond and Double Diamond they said it was the girls fault !!!! All that talk about integrity and all was nowhere to be found . This was all because this ex Army Helicopter Pilot had a big group in their LOS and kicking him out would cause all the uplines to loose a lot of money . Enough said my Poor Crossline buddy decided to quit as he could not follow ppl who speak something and do something else and i followed !! It is said these people still do the same ... Beware of a Certain Helicopter Pilot and His upline Diamonds !!

Anonymous said...

CMA,
I am sad to see that you feel this way about the Amway business. But you're wrong. This business has brought my family closer together and will allow us to be able to spend the day with our future children. This was a blessing from God and a once in a lifetime opportunity.

Dale Szewczyk said...

I am not sure how your upline was, but mine is different. Not only do I get receipts for all materials I buy, but I am also able to claim it all on my taxes. And that includes all travel expenses as well. Whenever I hear about someone talking about how bad Amway is, it's about something some IBO did, and has nothing to do with my upline. Maybe that's because my upline actually cares for their downline? I think so.

I understand if this business isn't for everybody, but not everyone has the negative experience that people who hate the business have dealt with. I also know Amway has changed a lot of their rules and structures to make it better for IBO's. So for the things that are actually a problem, they fix.

If you want to make money in this business, you gotta learn how to sell. Your products and yourself. And you have to be willing to always serve those you do business with. That's how it works. Overpromise and overdeliver. Which is the same in any entrepreneurial venture.

For those who have actually dealt with bad IBO's I am sorry you went through that. There's no excuse for such actions. But I can assure you that there are good IBO's who make money in this business and they do a great job leading. The BWW wants more Diamonds. They want us all to succeed. Because that means they are making more money when do, so of course, it makes sense to care for our success, which is a good thing because it's in their best interest we succeed.

Anonymous said...

Then why don't you clarify the money spent without receipt part. Do you say, without giving receipt for the money spent is legal business?

Anonymous said...

Joe I wish I'd found your blog before I got sucked in by these parasites. I joined a weight loss program last year but I didn't realise they were hooked up with Amway Australia. Anyway I had to use the Amway products or I couldn't do the program. I went to a few of the Business Development Seminars which were boring as all hell and they tried to con me into going to the Regional Seminars in Canberra. The last straw was when my now ex friend tried to get me to buy one of those "espring" water filters which cost over $1000 which would benefit her as she was my up line. My partner cracked and I returned it the next day.

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